The Bugninine Liturgy puts the Gospel story of Lazarus in place of the following in the real Mass, where Jesus confronts the Jews:
Which of you shall convince me of sin? If I say the truth to you, why do you not believe me:
He that is of God heareth the words of God. Therefore you hear them not, because you are not of God.
The Jews therefore answered and said to him: Do not we say well that thou art a Samaritan and hast a devil?
Jesus answered: I have not a devil: but I honour my Father. And you have dishonoured me.
But I seek not my own glory: there is one that seeketh and judgeth.
Amen, amen, I say to you: If any man keep my word, he shall not see death for ever.
The Jews therefore said: Now we know that thou hast a devil. Abraham is dead, and the prophets: and thou sayest: If any man keep my word, he shall not taste death for ever.
Art thou greater than our father Abraham who is dead? And the prophets are dead. Whom dost thou make thyself?
Jesus answered: If I glorify myself, my glory is nothing. It is my Father that glorifieth me, of whom you say that he is your God.
And you have not known him: but I know him. And if I shall say that I know him not, I shall be like to you, a liar. But I do know him and do keep his word.
Abraham your father rejoiced that he might see my day: he saw it and was glad.
The Jews therefore said to him: Thou art not yet fifty years old. And hast thou seen Abraham?
Jesus said to them: Amen, amen, I say to you, before Abraham was made, I AM.
They took up stones therefore to cast at him. But Jesus hid himself and went out of the temple.
AMDG
22 comments:
It's a sin against ecumenism and all that negative theology stuff...
They truly are the enemies of all mankind as St Paul said. They have managed to make it a crime for Christian people to pass on their culture and religion to their own offspring. They have convinced multitudes that sodomy is normal and they even have us sending Christian young men to their deaths to defend their anti-Christ country. Truly a brood of vipers. Con artists without rival.
Firstly, the Mass is Mass in all forty or fifty Rites and sub-rites.
Secondly, the Gospel cited above deals with Jesus the Jew having a debate with his fellow Jews who opposed him. Interesting too is that the discussion was held in Tudor English.
Cardinal Ladaria indicated that Jews and other non Catholics could be saved outside the Church with elements of sanctification or truth or where the true Church of Christ subsists outside the visible boundaries of the Church and there has been no objection from anyone.
MARCH 19, 2018
Today is the 19th day and sedevacantists and traditionalists have not noted that Cardinal Luiz Ladaria s.j made a mistake in the question and answer session of the Press Conference on Placuit Deo.
http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.it/2018/03/today-is-19th-day-and-sedevcantists-and.html
Cardinal Ladaria's liberalism on non Catholics being saved is based on Cushingite Vatican Council II.It is obsolete.The average Catholic, the rank and file Catholic is intelligent enough to know what is rational and who is faking it.They should expose it.
http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.it/2018/03/repost-liberalism-based-on-cushingite.html
Thank you!
In other words, the fact that Our Blessed Lord was a Jew absolves them of deicide and all the other murderous revolutions they have fomented. Got it,thanks for clearing that up Ray.
Cubic Zirkonia isn’t a real diamond, and yet they bear more resemblance to real diamonds than the Bugninine Liturgy does to the real Mass.
God is not interested in the least in this kind of exotic boutique Catholicism.
Furthermore, Lionel, only God knows who is 'saved' and no one else, least of all, the EEN theorists.
If God’s interests are in the hands of the Church’s lavender mafia, you might be correct.
God alone knows what eternity holds for every soul that comes into the Divine Presence at death.
EENS theorising is just that, trying to second, third and fourth guess God based on a Christless understanding of the Church as a club of the 'us v them' privileged few. This is a 'catholic' version of Mormonism.
The only person here presuming to know what God thinks is you.
Look up the official teaching of the Magisterium in the Catechism of the Catholic Church. It might help you and Lionel, straighten out some of the more obscure and sui generis notions of the particular EEN sect to which you subscribe.
Real Catholicism is exotic, boutique, Catholicism. Bill isn't a Catholic, he's an apologist for the ADL. He's probably either a Jew or a judaizer like the Christian zionists. He must be because he rejects the testimony of Our Blessed Lord who said "unless you believe that I am He, you will die in your sins." Of course that's exotic and boutique to an intellectual like the judaizer, Bill. We little, small minded, Catholics just take Christ at His word.
Some people don't like reality. Instead, they want to continue to live in the fantasy that the Jews are our friends, that they love Christians and are oh so tolerant. They don't want to face the reality that the Jews have set up a worldly kingdom in opposition to the rule of Christ the King. It's truly the elephant in the room. Our Lord himself said as much in the parable of the wicked husbandmen. If you want to know how the Jews think,that parable encapsulates it.
Look up the official teaching of the Magisterium in the Catechism of the Catholic Church.
VI. THE NECESSITY OF BAPTISM
1257 The Lord himself affirms that Baptism is necessary for salvation.60 He also commands his disciples to proclaim the Gospel to all nations and to baptize them.61 Baptism is necessary for salvation for those to whom the Gospel has been proclaimed and who have had the possibility of asking for this sacrament.62 The Church does not know of any means other than Baptism that assures entry into eternal beatitude; this is why she takes care not to neglect the mission she has received from the Lord to see that all who can be baptized are "reborn of water and the Spirit." God has bound salvation to the sacrament of Baptism, but he himself is not bound by his sacraments.-Catechism of the Catholic Church.
Lionel: The Church is saying all Jews and other non Christians are on the way to Hell without the baptism of water.
The Church is saying theoretically God is not bound to the Sacraments.In principle God can do what he wants being God.However defacto, in real life, everyone with no known exceptions needs to enter the Church with the baptism of water.No baptism no salvation.
The baptism of water is given to adults with faith. So Vatican Council II says all need faith and baptism for salvation.(Ad Gentes 7).
So the Church supports the 'rigorist interpretation' of the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus. This is official.
MARCH 19, 2018
There are so many Catholics who are aware of the Ladaria Error but they want to maintain their privileges and interests so they keep quiet about it: No Comment from the Vatican Secretariate of Communications
http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.it/2018/03/there-are-so-many-catholics-who-are.html
Therefore, all must be converted to Him, made known by the Church's preaching, and all must be incorporated into Him by baptism and into the Church which is His body. For Christ Himself "by stressing in express language the necessity of faith and baptism (cf. Mark 16:16; John 3:5), at the same time confirmed the necessity of the Church, into which men enter by baptism, as by a door. -Ad Gentes 7, Vatican Council II.
Bill Danby
The Magisterium and the CCC on Salvation
The Church recognizes that God does not condemn those who are innocently ignorant of the truth about his offer of salvation.
Lionel: This is not a reference to an exception to Ad Gentes 7, Vatican Council II. We cannot know any one in 2018 who is 'innocently ignorant of the truth' in 2018 and is saved.
_______________
Regarding the doctrine in question, the Catechism of the Catholic Church (quoting Vatican II document Lumen Gentium, 16) states:
This affirmation is not aimed at those who, through no fault of their own...they know it through the dictates of their conscience—those too may achieve eternal salvation. (CCC 847)
Lionel. This is a reference to a hypothetical case. It is not a reference to someone in particular known to be saved in invincible ignorance.So it is not relevant or an exception to the old exclusivist ecclesiology of the Catholic Church.
So it is not an official negation.
_________________________
Vatican II document Gaudium Et Spes teaches similarly on the possibility of salvation:
Lionel: A possibility is a hypothetical case. It can only be accepted as such. It must not be mistaken as being a known person saved as such.
So GS 22, like LG 8 ,Lg 16,UR 3, NS 2 etc are not exceptions to EENS as it was known to the missionaries and Magisterium of the 16th century.
__________________
All this holds true not only for Christians, but for all men of good will...the Holy Spirit in a manner known only to God offers to every man the possibility of being associated with this paschal mystery. (Gaudium et Spes 22)
Lionel:. Again, this is a reference to a hypothetical case a possibility known only to God. Possibilities are not real people.
So officially there are not known exceptions to EENS.-Lionel Andrades
Vatican Council II is in harmomy with the traditional teachings of the Church interpreted without the Ladaria Error. The liberal reading of Vatican Council II with the for and against EENS method instead of the for and neutral to EENS method, is now obsolete. Without the irrationality, the false premise, which comes with the for and against EENS method of reading Vatican Councl II, the liberals cannot any more cite the Council.It is they who are bankrupt.-Lionel
Like Vatican Council II, the Letter of the Holy Office 1949 can be interpreted with the for and against EENS method or the for and neutral to EENS method , with or without the Ladaria Error, with or without the false premise and the conclusion will be different.
Like Vatican Council II, the Letter of the Holy Office 1949 to the Archbishop of Boston can be interpreted with the for and against EENS method or the for and neutral to EENS method , with the Ladaria Error or without it, with the false premise or without it.The conclusion would be different.
So when the baptism of desire(BOD), baptism of blood(BOB) and being saved in invincible ignorance(I.I) is mentioned in the Letter(1949) there are two ways to interpret it.1) We can assume that they refer to hypothetical cases known only to God or 2) we can infer, as is commonly done, that it refers to known people saved outside the Church, saved without the baptism of water in the Catholic Church.Or we can assume that we humans can know of people who will be saved outside the Church, without Catholic faith and the baptism of water.
We can assume that they refer to invisible people in 2018 and this would be the obvious choice or we can wrongly assume that they refer to visible people in 2018. Either way our conclusion would be different since the premise is different.
The Holy Office 1949 during the pontificate of Pope Pius XII chose the irrational option. It assumed that BOD, BOB and I.I referred to known people saved outside the Church, in other words, there were personally known people saved in 1949 without the baptism of water.So BOD, BOB and I.I became an exception to Feeneyite EENS.
Similarly at Vatican Council II , Lumen Gentium 16( invincible ignorance), Lumen Gentium 14( case of the catechumen) etc is read by the Magisterium today as exceptions to traditional, Feeneyite EENS.So on March 1,2018 Cardinal Luiz Ladaria at the Press Conference on Placuit Deo in answer to a question, said Lumen Gentium 8 was an exception to the old exclusivist understanding of salvation.
This indicates that he interprets the Letter of the Holy Office 1949 and Vatican Council II with the for and against EENS method, with the false premise and with the Ladaria Error.
So the Letter of the Holy Office 1949 heretically said that it was not necessary that everyone be a member of the Catholic Church for salvation, while the dogma EENS defined by three Church Councils says, it is necessary.
The Letter of the Holy Office was an innovation in the Church with a new theology based on an irrational philosophical premise.It was accepted by the Magisteriium of the Church .
-Lionel Andrades
The Letter of the Holy Office 1949 is in heresy schism since it rejects the teachings of the popes and considers them to be in heresy on extra ecclesiam nulla salus.The Letter creates a schism with the past popes.
The Letter says ' that one may obtain eternal salvation, it is not always required that he be incorporated into the Church actually as a member' while the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus,defined by three Church Councils says it is necessary.
So the Letter is in schism with the past popes including those who affirmed EENS in the ordinary Magisterium. We have to note that when they referred to the baptism of desire(BOD), baptism of blood(BOB) and being saved in invincible ignorance(I:I) it was to hypothetical cases which were not relevant or exceptions to their traditional and strict interpretation of EENS.
So today we have to choose between the past popes or the heretical and schismatic Letter of the Holy Office to the Archbishop of Boston 1949.
I am a Feeneyite. The Letter is Cushingite.
The past popes were Feeneyite.The present two popes are Cushingite.a
The two popes accept the second part of the Letter. I reject.I accept the first part of the Letter which is contradicted by the second part.
If it is said that I am in heresy then be consistent and say that all the past popes are in heresy. Also Vatican Council II would be in heresy for saying all need faith and baptism for salvation (Ad Gentes 7).
I affirm Vatican Council II (Feeneyite).I am not saying anything new.I am affirming what the popes have said down the centuries and which is in harmony with Vatican Council II.So I accept the first part of the Letter and reject the second part since it contradicts the first part, with the use of an irrationality, a false premise, nonsensical theology, which was politically expedient in 1949..
So those Catholics who follow the irrational reasoning of the Letter(1949) end up in heresy on EENS, Nicene Creed, Vatican Council II etc and in schism with the past popes over the centuries on extra ecclesiam nulla salus.
It was based upon the irrational reasoning of the Letter(1949) that Cardinal Ladaria on March 1, 2018 at the Press Conference of Placuit Deo, in the question and answer session, said that Lumen Gentium 8 is a rupture with the past exclusivist understanding of salvation.-Lionel Andrades
MARCH 24, 2018
Vatican in agreement
See. There is no denial from the Vatican.
1. They agree that Lumen Gentium 8 is not an exception to the exclusivist ecclesiology of the Church on salvation.
Image result for vatican media photos
2.They agree that all Catholic religious communities and lay Movements can interpret LG 8 as not being an exception or relevant to Feeneyiteextra ecclesiam nulla salus(EENS).
Vatican Council II can be interpreted in harmony with EENS as it was known to the missionaries and Magisterium of the 16th century.
Vatican Council II is also in harmony with the Syllabus of Errors and an ecumenism of return.-Lionel Andrades
MARCH 21, 2018
Like Vatican Council II, the Letter of the Holy Office 1949 can be interpreted with the for and against EENS method or the for and neutral to EENS method , with or without the Ladaria Error, with or without the false premise and the conclusion will be different
http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.it/2018/03/like-vatican-council-ii-letter-of-holy.html
MARCH 17, 2018
Liberalism based on Cushingite Vatican Council II is obsolete.The average Catholic, the rank and file Catholic is intelligent enough to know what is rational and who is faking it
http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.it/2018/03/liberalism-based-on-cushingite-vatican.html
MARCH 17, 2018
Sedevacantism based on Vatican Council II(Cushingite), with the for and against EENS method of reading the text will become obsolete.Traditionalists and liberals too will have to switch to for and neutral to EENS method
http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.it/2018/03/sedevacantism-based-on-vatican-council.html
MARCH 18, 2018
Sedevacantism and the old traditionalism is obsolete : new option for Franciscans of the Immaculate and all religious communities
http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.it/2018/03/secularism-and-old-traditionalism-is.html
http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.it/2018/03/vatican-in-agreement.html
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